Raw Editing Workflow - dng Files/Cinema DNG Files Sequence

[photorobot2010]

Hello!

Playing with sample raw footage from Blackmagic's site for the Ursa Mini and in my research, using the Lumetri Color panel edits the footage just like a raw video/photo clip.

Can someone please confirm that I'm making edits to the raw files just like I would with a single raw file in Adobe Lightroom or Adobe Camera Raw using this workflow?

Using this workflow:

Premiere CC 2015: Import/Color Grading RAW Black Magic Cinema DNG Files - YouTube

Sample footage downloaded here:

Blackmagic Design: Blackmagic URSA Mini​

Premiere Pro Info:

2015.3

Build: 10.3.0 (202)

Mac Info:

OS X El Capitan

10.11.6 (15G1004)

[R Neil Haugen]

Even though I came into video as a long-time stills portrait shooter with a LOT of experience in Lightroom/ACR, I'm not sure I quite understand your question.

Are you asking whether the changes you make are applied to one frame-image or the whole stream for that "clip", or whether the changes are recorded in an XMP file beside the RAW file on disk ... or ... ?

PrPro "sees" these files as clips in operation ... except for when it obviously fails. And PrPro's changes to files are always saved to the PrPro project file and I don't think to a clip's data header stuff. Just in case either answers your query. Could be wrong on that one.

PrPro does at times have problem with CinemaDNG files. And for some, it works beautifully.

Neil

[photorobot2010]

Thanks for the reply. Editing raw meaning in making changes to the metadata of the raw file as opposed to making pixel level changes to a jpg or h.264 video file. I'm not sure how Premiere Pro edits raw video files, if it changes the metadata for the entire raw video clip or if it's making metadata changes at the individual raw frame level. Does that help? Coming from years of still photography as well.

[R Neil Haugen]

My understanding is that PrPro saves all changes (no matter whether cuts, time-ramps, color, transitions, anything & everything) only in the PrPro project file ... no matter whether the media is CinemaDNG, RAW, or any "standard" codec. It uses that to play-back the media while editing, and applies the changes to any exported media you create from the project. So I don't think it creates an XMP file next to the original media as say Lightroom does.

You can always do a quick test ... make a few changes, exit PrPro so they're saved, and check to see if any XMP files appear. I don't think they will.

Perhaps Jim_Simon​, ProDesignTools​, or @RoninEdits would be able to give a more definitive answer.

Neil

[photorobot2010]

Thank you Neil!

[excited_Genie16B8]

The Basic controls of the Lumetri effect in PP are supposed to be changing the actual RAW settings, rather than applying the adjustments to the decoded video.  However, PP doesn't handle CinemaDNG properly, applying a LUT automatically that we can't remove or alter.

I recommend learning to use Resolve.  I am.

[photorobot2010]

Thank you Jim. Are you able to elaborate on PP not handling the CInemaDNG properly? So then is PP then not manipulating the raw data but rather using a LUT? Can we look at PP handling CinemaDNG with the LUT as basically an adjustment layer that sits on top of the footage? Also, when you say LUT, are you referring to the look that's created using the Lumetri panel?

[excited_Genie16B8]

The best way to understand the situation is to import the same footage into both PP and Resolve.  You will see the additional control you have in Resolve that is missing in PP.

That difference makes PP unusable for CinemaDNG, I feel.

Shame that.  You'd think Adobe's NLE would handle their own format better than the competition.

[photorobot2010]

Thanks Jim!

[photorobot2010]

Is it possible to have a true raw editing workflow for CinemaDNG in Speedgrade?

[excited_Genie16B8]

Given Adobe's abandonment of SpeedGrade, I didn't even try.

[R Neil Haugen]

I don't think SpeedGrade recognizes CinemaDNG in "native" mode, I'll check later today though. But I don't recall that one being used. Older formats like DPX & such, of course ...

Neil

[dummergold]

SpeedGrade opens that 6G sample Aerial Road Shot of the URSA mini

I use Adobe Camera Raw, via After Effects compositions and import into Premiere Pro for my cDNG

[photorobot2010]

Thank you for the info. How do you apply an  edit using ACR to multiple DNG's at once using the ACR/AE method without having to make changes to each frame individually?

[dummergold · Accepted solution]

The AE comp duration is the length of you dng sequence.

The Camera Raw sequence, when imported into AE opens the first frame in ACR, so you only get to adjust the first image, all sequential frames have the xmp applied as you have adjusted on the first frame.

If I wish to have a different frame to represent my image sequence with respect to color, I copy any select frame (open the one frame in ACR) save the xmp, replace the AE comp footage with the same cDNG sequence, - the same first frame loads into ACR and I load the xmp of that select frame - then the AE comp needs to be 'reloaded' for the change to apply.

If I want many versions of the cDNG AE comp, I do many versions, stack in PP and adjust video layers to suit.

[excited_Genie16B8]

Eeesh!  Use Resolve, man.  It just works.

[photorobot2010]

Lol I tried Resolve today. I like it. Just looking for options that are efficient and give me the true raw editing experience I'm used to like in LR and ACR. Thanks for the info all. I'll have to try the AE workflow again. AE was having me make edits to each frame in the cDNG sequence. Thanks for your time all.

[dummergold]

there is a method to use your LR xmp in the AE cDNG comps as well, I let that knowledge fade

as for AE having you make edits for each frame, sounds like inside PP, replacing image sequence with AE comp, then AE triggered ACR for each frame - I don't know if that was ever fixed - another corner I avoided