Source and Program Monitors do not match

[davebrown479]

Premiere Pro v 22.0.0 

Source and Program monitors look VERY different on .RAW footage.  Lumeteri Color seems to make it rather worse.  Can't seem to reclaim any of the detail the Source window displays no matter what I adjust.  Options?

[R Neil Haugen]

This is quite possibly due to the massive changes in both the basic underlying color mamagement of Pr2022 and the default behaviors it now adopts with many log-encoded and/or HLG media clips.

I've got two FAQs here ... the first on the changes, and how to work within the new system.

The second ... how to monitor HDR sequences, as it seems that has changed completely also in the Pr2022 release.

Neil

FAQ:PremierePro 2022 Color Managment for Log/RAW Media

How to Set Monitors for HDR work in Premiere Pro 2022?

[R Neil Haugen · Accepted solution]

And my guess is your clip there is either log-encoded or an HLG "HDR" clip.

So check the clip properties in the bin. If it is HLG, for most purposes you will still want to work in SDR, standard dynamic range, the Rec.709 standards of still the vast majority of media today. If so, right-click one or more clips in the bin, then Modify/Interpret Footage" and set the Color Management options at the bottom for Override to Rec.709.

Then in the Sequence settings, make sure the CM is set to Rec.709. And make sure the Scopes are also showing a Rec.709 signal by right-clicking in the scopes panel, selecting the color Rec.709 color space. Then set the scale dropdown in the lower right corner of the scopes to 8bit or 10bit.

Neil

[davebrown479]

Thank you so very much.  I don't think I'd have ever figured it out on my own.

[R Neil Haugen]

Yea, right?

The changes are simply massive, but ... not all that obvious to be polite. It's been a surprise in a number of ways even for someone like me who's considered an expert at Premiere's color management. I've spent hours with the staff checking things out and working on this topic with pro colorists also. And a couple changes surprised me.

In the public beta apps, they have a beaker icon on the upper right of the program menu bars. It is to inform public beta users of changes ... anytime that beaker has a blue dot,  you're supposed to click on it to see the changes. Easy and useful!

I've suggested that this would be a Very Good Thing for the shipping version, as that way users could quickly check for and track any changes.

Neil

[Geoffrey Beane]

Holy cow. "I don't think I would ever have figured this out" is more like "I know I would never have figured this out." Thank you.

[R Neil Haugen]

Taking Premiere from an auto-Rec.709/SDR app into a "modern" color-space agnostic app was always gonna have a certain level of pain for both the devs and the users. Because of being such a massive change.

A complete "paradigm" shift, really. From all CM controls set in stone in application code, with no effective CM user controls.

To CM controls now being the responsibility of the user. And with CM controls suddenly appearing in various places.

Which is why I've argued for one "Essential Color Management" panel. That would be a LOT easier for people to see and grasp the use of.

Neil

[Blake28407681b8db]

You, sir, won the internet for me today. 

What happened to me is I imported video from someone's cell phone and I placed it on my timeline first. This defaulted my sequence to another dynamic range. I had to override the clips to Rec.709 AND I needed to change the sequence settings back to Rec.709 and that fixed me up. 

Thank you for your perfect answer to this question. My 30 minute headache was resolved in seconds thanks to your contribution. 

[R Neil Haugen]

Glad to hear my comments were of help. It's kind of a mess now, and is puzzling as Hades for most people. So many things do X just fine, seem to do Y ok, but if you had Z in effect while you did Y, what the ... ?????

Neil

[aloisius nandiw37366825]

Dear all,

I have recently updated my Premiere Pro to the newest 2022 version. I'm working on footages from Sony A7III, 4K, with HLG 3 as its picture profile.
The look of the original footage shows no problem at all with perfectly good exposure, which can be seen from the source monitor on the left. However, there is a distinct difference with how the footage looks on the program monitor on the right.
The footage looks washed out with the highlight is overly saturated on the program monitor.


Can anyone please help me what to do to fix it? 
I've been editing for 3yrs+ and this is my first time encountering a problem like this

Current Sequence Settings:

Any help is much appreciated. Thank you!

[Ann Bens]

FAQ: How to fix saturated/over exposed HLG clips PPro v22 - Adobe Support Community

Premiere Pro V22 - Understanding Color Spaces, HDR, and what that might mean to you - YouTube

[R Neil Haugen]

They have completely rebuilt the underlying color system in Premiere in Pr2022. And many default behaviors are different, as the links Ann provided will tell you.

I am curious about your shooting HLG clips, though, as so few screens can work with it. I work with a large group of pro colorists, and the vast majority of them have yet to deliver one job in any HDR form is why I'm asking.

Anyway ... Premiere's HDR implementation in 2022 is well ahead of 2021's capabilities. But many operating features are either incomplete or not functioning with some media as the engineers expected. So it is still a bit wonky.

They're working at getting some changes implemented, including replacing the current transform processes with tonemapping, but we have no clue how long that will take. In the mean time, working within HDR is ... tricky.

For those clips in HLG to work on a Rec.709 timeline, you need to go to the clips in their bin in the project panel. Select all clips needing to work in Rec.709, right-click/Modify/Interpret Footage, and select the CM option at the bottom to Override to Rec.709.

Now they should work on the Rec.709 timeline.

And I'm providing a couple more links with extensive information about the changes and how to work within Pr2022, and one on how to monitor HDR in Pr2022, as that has also changed.

Neil

FAQ:PremierePro 2022 Color Management for Log/RAW Media

How to Set Monitors for HDR work in Premiere Pro 2022?

[default5yhexgdmnptd]

Thank you, This saved me. I was creating a hyperlapse from my Mavic Air2 Pro. Edited the raws in lightroom and exported them to jpg folder. I imported the photos using the image sequence option and everything looked fine in the source window. But in the Program window, everything looked noticeably washed out. I first tried meddling with my graphics card settings to no avail, your comment on manually overriding the colorspace of the clip fixed the issue. 

I think it would be interesting to note that I only experienced this unwanted color shift with certain sources of footage, notably from my drone or DSLR. GoPro and Iphone never need any tinkering. 

I think it would also be important to note that I did not experience anything like this until I updated to Premiere 2022...Now it's just another step I have to take. 

[R Neil Haugen]

Prior to the 2022 version, Premiere's underlying color system was totally built on Rec.709 math. Even the limited capabilities it had for HLG/PQ were based on coding in the ability to work with "over-range Rec.709 values" ... which was only ever going to be a temporary solution.

And in the old Rec.709 system, yes ... everything defaulted to a Rec.709 view unless you changed the one or two things you could.

Starting with the Pr2022 version, that all went away. The underlying math is "color space agnostic" ... so yes, the user now has to take control of color management.

Neil

So yes,

[ryanmuir]

I'm having this problem too. non HDR footage and timeline (I checked), but it is a new macbook pro with HDR screen.

[ryanmuir]

Oh interesting, I started the project on the laptop computer with a second monitor plugged in (not HDR), then I detached to continue working-- thats where the color issue started. Rebooted app (without reattaching to monitor) and the color came up as it was supposed to. Hope that helps someone.

[DamienNeva]

Premiere Pro 23.1.0

Source monitor isn’t showing full video like the program monitor. Camera produces a 1920x1080 MP4, which I rotated -90°. However when I view the same video in the source the top and bottom of the footage does not display.  If I adjust the scale of the source video and then drag the video into the timeline, it’s smaller than the full frame in the program monitor. Help please. Thank you.

Damien