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The soundness of logic of sound and the multiplicities of multicam

Contributor ,
Jul 26, 2017 Jul 26, 2017

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The following observations assume the following PPro architecture:

There are 4 basic sound "types": Mono, Stereo, Adaptive, 5.1

PPro allows control of these types at several places Source Clip, Sequence Track, and Sequence Output.

Observation 1 - What Source Clip Tracks are compatible w/ What Sequence Tracks?

On the surface it makes sense that an Adaptive source clip's track can't be edited into a Mono or Stereo sequence track -- "Multiple tracks in a single or dual track item?!  What would you be hearing anyway?"

Yet at the same time PPro provides an alternative model that rattles the above presumption:

A Stereo source clip track CAN be edited into a Mono sequence track, no problem.  To the question "what are you hearing?", the answer lies in the setup found in "Timeline Clip > Context Menu > Audio Channels" which opens a popup allowing you to choose from Source Left or Source Right (not, curiously, a mix of both).

By the same logic, would it not make more sense to accommodate an Adaptive source track Edited into a Mono or Stereo sequence track?

Observation 2 - Audio Track Mixer Panel's L/R panning

A bit of a tangent, but it's related:

Intuitively it would seem this feature would control the output for the entirety of a sequence track whose Sequence Output is of type stereo.  Instead those balance dials choose between L/R assigns of its sources.  I'm not a sound mixer, but in my admittedly limited experience, balance knobs control output not input.

Observation 3 - Direct Patching vs L/R pairing in the "Audio Channels: popup.

"Timeline Clip > Context Menu > Audio Channels" or "Modify > Audio Channels" which opens a popup with matrix of Audio Assign check marks.

The counterintuitive in Observation 2 is based on a PPro built-in logic that insists on L/R pairings, in the traditional logic of Odds/Left, Evens/Right.  Great.

What's seems inconsistent: If I've got an adaptive Source Clip Track, an Adaptive Sequence Track, and an Adaptive Sequence Output, L/R balance seems like a uninvited house guest.  And yet there it is.

Observation 4 - The 32-Tracks per Adaptive Sound Assigns Matrix

At times you find yourself at times looking at a grid of check marks stretching across to 32 columns, then down by 32 rows (many not-in-play), multiplying out by as many sources in your multicam quickly -- an Einstein-boggling array of choices and perhaps not the most effective UI.

All of this comes into play when confronting a project that makes use of multicam sequences, multi-channel production sound, elaborate timelines, and demanding deliverables.

There is no doubt Adobe has put serious thought, expertise, and intelligence into its sound and multicam architecture.  The ideas they're getting at, the power under the hood is not just rivaling Avid; it's leaving them in the dust.  Yet it's anything but complete.  There are holes in the logic, intuitiveness and UIs that are gaping enough as to frequently undermine what looks to be an awe-inspiring array of editing breakthroughs.

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LEGEND ,
Jul 26, 2017 Jul 26, 2017

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I've got to be honest, I didn't read your entire post.  So I don't know if this will help, but I figured it's worth a shot.

Everything You Ever Wanted to Know About Audio in Premiere Pro CC - YouTube

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Contributor ,
Jul 26, 2017 Jul 26, 2017

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It's a great video.  Extremely helpful, but alas, there's always more to know.

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Advisor ,
Jul 27, 2017 Jul 27, 2017

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Here's some (garbled) notes I made when I was trying to figure out 5.1 workflows:

SEQUENCE AUDIO MASTER MODES:

Mono - 1 output only - no pan, no assignment, no mapping

Stereo - 2 outputs only - LR pan - no assignment - mapping to 2 inputs to 2 outputs on adaptive tracks

Multichannel - 1 to 32 outputs - LR pan - assignment of mono/stereo to 16 pairs (even when only 1 output) - mapping n inputs to n outputs on adaptive

5.1 - 6 outputs only - no pan - no assignment - mapping 6 ins to 6 outs on adaptive tracks

Timeline Master Outputs:

Mono/Stereo/5.1/Multichannel (MC 1-32 tracks - needed for discrete outputs)

AUDIO TIMELINE TRACKS:

Mono - Take mono (unity), stereo (centre pan -6dB) can be panned and MC assigned

Standard - Take mono (centre pan -3dB), stereo (unity) can be balanced and MC assigned

Adaptive - Take mono (centre pan, unity), stereo (unity), adaptive

  Allow INPUT mapping (e.g. Front Left to all 4 tracks)

  Allow OUTPUT mapping of that track (e.g. 1 to 1,5 &12, 2 to none) BEWARE have seen summing of previous material

also NB - Adaptive tracks have the same number of channels as its sequence - can be mapped, balanced and MC assigned

5.1 - Take 5.1 only

ensure sequence audio tracks are 'adaptive' for stereo or multichannel. - REALLY? I think they can be Stereo and less complicated

LR pan on multichannel inputs is amount of input passed through

audio track mixer not visible by default

mono - only 1 output. Stereo will be centre panned.

stereo - 2 outputs mono will become dual mono, stereo will be L&R

adaptive - as stereo but has output routing (e.g. None / 1 only / 2 only / 1&2) & panning in clip mixer

'effects control' for clip volume / pan etc… keyframable (by default - click stopwatch to disable)

'clip mixer' for fader control of clip volume

click on 'fx' icon for clip to view different envelopes (volume / pan etc) on clip by clip basis

not possible to take 2 track stereo and put just to centre

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Contributor ,
Jul 27, 2017 Jul 27, 2017

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Trevor_Asq  wrote

Here's some (garbled) notes I made when I was trying to figure out 5.1 workflows:

...

Love this post.  Helpful and hilarious.  I have a bunch of similar lists.

I greatly appreciate PPro's commitment to sound in editing, and its willingness to take on the complexities with a sophisticated and layered interface.

What's lacking at this point is consistency, coherence and elegance.  Your notes are less "garbled" than they are a reflection of an elaborate construction far from complete, at odds with prevailing standards and its own internal logic.

Highlights from your notes that leaped out:

'effects control' for clip volume / pan etc… keyframable (by default - click stopwatch to disable)

Counter-intuitively mysteriously reverse of norm.

Mono - 1 output only - no pan, no assignment, no mapping

Great observation: peculiar behavior.

various stereo/mono/adaptive notes

Seem to break all kinds of standard operating procedures in ways that, far from resulting in benefits, create obstacles.

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