P: Gpu stops being used after opening many files

[DjAligator14]

Windows 10 

For better understanding i've added a video, also the import time is very slow.

https://youtu.be/Y9c96ylYE4I

[Mark.Dahm]

@Arseniy_S ,

Sorry for the long silence on this thread. 

The limit was put into place to stop TDR violations that were crashing many systems, particularly with older GPU hardware.

The essential problem is that each window requires gpu resources, and opening 100 documents on a 4k system will exhaust the resources of even the best-equipped cards. We used to have a way to steal resources away from unused windows, allocating them to the most active documents, but lost it, and have been working to solve that problem since then.

We discussed adding a workaround in a build that removed that limit, to see if it would work for better systems, but some of us recalled that in the past, this didn't' work that well even on great hardware. A bit has changed since then, so we'll give it another try; if it works, it might be a suitable workaround for more robust hardware to handle the workflows needed here.

We are closer to solving the core issue, which is tighter management of the GPU resourcing, to the point of actually confining it to just the active document, which would be the most efficient solution for the long run (since interactivity is not required for the other documents). But reviewing this discussion does make me think that we'll have to test the impact that this will have on scripted workflows, as we would not want the slow those processes down with our solution.

So again, I apologize that it has taken this long route to resolving the issue, but we are closer to solving the issue, and we are taking a breather to test this workaround in the hopes that it might be a band-aid until we can ship our ultimate fix.

[mlphoto.raw]

This is great to hear @Mark.Dahm, thanks for the update. When should we expect the update to roll out? Q2? Q3? 2024? 

[Mark.Dahm]

@mlphoto.raw , we're working on the temporary removal of the limit here in the next couple of weeks, and should have a read on how well that allows better cards to handle higher document totals being open at the same time.

The true fix is still real hard to project a firm date; I'd say the earliest we might see this could be this Fall. If/when it happens, it would come with a significant boost in interactivity (which was the true goal of the effort). But given this is such a low-level change, it's a low probability becuase of the breadth of testing required. We will put this change in the Beta version of Photoshop, which is free for all subscribers, the moment it's stable, so look for it there first.

[Arseniy_S]

@Mark.Dahm, thank you for the update and transparency on the issue! Looking forward to hear from you soon.

[Mark.Dahm]

Just another update on this; we are close to having a gestalt the will let customers enter whatever number they like for the maximum number of images using the GPU. We are going to test this internally, and if it works in some cases, will release this in the Beta for general use. Meanwhile, we're working out a solution that tries to keep the GPU working on just the top document, so it puts less pressure on the GPU while using Photoshop. That will take longer to solve, but we think that's the right solution.

[davescm]

Great update Mark - thank you. 🙂

Dave

[Mark.Dahm]

Another update, the ability to define the maximum number of GPU-backed windows has been testing well, but it did not go into the release that just came out today (24.4.1); it is scheduled to be available in the next BETA build (which you can get to in the Creative Cloud app by clicking on the Beta tab) next Friday, May 5. It will be a happy cinco de mayo, for interested folks.

[Mark.Dahm]

@Arseniy_S , @DjAligator14 ,

If you grab the latest BETA version of Photoshop, and have been noticing this issue on Windows, the Beta version now more efficiently allocates (and recovers) GPU memory for documents that are NOT the topmost document. This should let you increase the number of windows you open where you can use the GPU, theoretically letting you go as far as your hardware will take you. How far will that be? Try it out and let us know! We've been trying here and beefier cards are able to fly right past that former limit; try it out and let us know how it goes.

[Gixxxa75]

Been so long, I cant remember the exact issue I was having this, think it was scrubby zoom not working with over 25 files open. Thats seems to have been cured with the Beta version. Had 133 6ish MB jpegs open and seems OK now. 

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PCX 24.5 - from the file “PCX.8bi”
Photocopy 24.5 - from the file “Filter Gallery.8bf”
Picture Package Filter 24.5 - from the file “ChannelPort.8bf”
Pinch 24.5 - from the file “Standard MultiPlugin.8bf”
Pixar 24.5 - from the file “Pixar.8bi”
Plaster 24.5 - from the file “Filter Gallery.8bf”
Plastic Wrap 24.5 - from the file “Filter Gallery.8bf”
Pointillize 24.5 - from the file “Standard MultiPlugin.8bf”
Polar Coordinates 24.5 - from the file “Standard MultiPlugin.8bf”
Portable Bit Map 24.5 - from the file “PBM.8bi”
Poster Edges 24.5 - from the file “Filter Gallery.8bf”
Radial Blur 24.5 - from the file “Standard MultiPlugin.8bf”
Radiance 24.5 - from the file “Radiance.8bi”
Range 24.5 - from the file “statistics.8ba”
Render Color Lookup Grid 24.5 - from the file “Export3DLUT.8be”
Reticulation 24.5 - from the file “Filter Gallery.8bf”
Ripple 24.5 - from the file “Standard MultiPlugin.8bf”
Rough Pastels 24.5 - from the file “Filter Gallery.8bf”
Save for Web 24.5 - from the file “Save for Web.8be”
ScriptingSupport 24.5 - from the file “ScriptingSupport.8li”
Shear 24.5 - from the file “Standard MultiPlugin.8bf”
Skewness 24.5 - from the file “statistics.8ba”
Smart Blur 24.5 - from the file “Standard MultiPlugin.8bf”
Smudge Stick 24.5 - from the file “Filter Gallery.8bf”
Solarize 24.5 - from the file “Solarize.8bf”
SP Substance Suite NO VERSION - from the file “MaterialSuite.8li”
Spatter 24.5 - from the file “Filter Gallery.8bf”
Spherize 24.5 - from the file “Standard MultiPlugin.8bf”
Sponge 24.5 - from the file “Filter Gallery.8bf”
Sprayed Strokes 24.5 - from the file “Filter Gallery.8bf”
Stained Glass 24.5 - from the file “Filter Gallery.8bf”
Stamp 24.5 - from the file “Filter Gallery.8bf”
Standard Deviation 24.5 - from the file “statistics.8ba”
Substance NO VERSION - from the file “MaterialFilter.8bf”
Sumi-e 24.5 - from the file “Filter Gallery.8bf”
Summation 24.5 - from the file “statistics.8ba”
Targa 24.5 - from the file “Standard MultiPlugin.8bf”
Texturizer 24.5 - from the file “Filter Gallery.8bf”
Tiles 24.5 - from the file “Standard MultiPlugin.8bf”
Topaz Gigapixel AI NO VERSION - from the file “GigapixelAIAutomation.8li”
Torn Edges 24.5 - from the file “Filter Gallery.8bf”
Twirl 24.5 - from the file “Standard MultiPlugin.8bf”
Underpainting 24.5 - from the file “Filter Gallery.8bf”
Vanishing Point 24.5 - from the file “VanishingPoint.8bf”
Variance 24.5 - from the file “statistics.8ba”
Water Paper 24.5 - from the file “Filter Gallery.8bf”
Watercolor 24.5 - from the file “Filter Gallery.8bf”
Wave 24.5 - from the file “Standard MultiPlugin.8bf”
WIA Support 24.5 - from the file “WIASupport.8li”
Wind 24.5 - from the file “Standard MultiPlugin.8bf”
Wireless Bitmap 24.5 - from the file “WBMP.8bi”
ZigZag 24.5 - from the file “Standard MultiPlugin.8bf”

Optional and third party plugins: NONE

Duplicate and Disabled plugins: NONE

Plugins that failed to load: NONE

Unified Extensibility Platform - Extensions:

Home Screen (Loaded) 6.6.0.46 - from the file "Required Folder"
CDO: 1.138.1
CmdN: 1.18.5
CDP: 1.162.1
Projects: 1.7.0
Loaded at: 123 ms - launch time impact: 68 ms
ccx-timeline (Prepared) 3.1.10.0 - from the file "Required Folder"
CCX Commenting UXP Webview (Loaded) 27.3.1.0 - from the file "Required Folder"
Loaded at: 7959 ms - launch time impact: 0 ms
Beta Feedback (Prepared) 1.15.1.0 - from the file "Required Folder"
CCX Sharesheet UXP (Prepared) 24.10.0.0 - from the file "Required Folder"
Photoshop Cloud Value Dialog (Loaded) 1.0.1.0 - from the file "Required Folder"
Loaded at: 129 ms - launch time impact: 0 ms
Share Panel (Loaded) 1.0.6.0 - from the file "Required Folder"
Loaded at: 131 ms - launch time impact: 0 ms
Content Credentials (Loaded) 0.37.3.0 - from the file "Required Folder"
Loaded at: 5321 ms - launch time impact: 5 ms
CC Libraries Panel (Prepared) 3.22.9.0 - from the file "C:\Program Files\Common Files\Adobe/CEP/Extensions\CC_LIBRARIES_PANEL_EXTENSION_3_22_9\"
CAPTURE: 2.0.41 STOCK: 4.0.2
Substance 3D (Prepared) 0.1.6.0 - from the file "Required Folder"
Adjustments Panels (Prepared) 1.12.33.0 - from the file "Required Folder"
Photoshop UXP Export-As (Prepared) 5.8.23.0 - from the file "Required Folder"
Photoshop Facepile (Loaded) 1.2.1.0 - from the file "Required Folder"
Loaded at: 7961 ms - launch time impact: 0 ms
Photoshop In App Messaging (Loaded) 3.11.1.0 - from the file "Required Folder"
Loaded at: 7963 ms - launch time impact: 1 ms
Photoshop Selection Feedback (Prepared) 0.5.0.0 - from the file "Required Folder"
Plugins Panel (Prepared) 1.4.3.0 - from the file "Required Folder"
IC popup message (Loaded) 1.0.0.0
Loaded at: 5502 ms - launch time impact: 0 ms
Multilayer Protection (Loaded) 1.0.0.0
Loaded at: 5504 ms - launch time impact: 0 ms
Discover Panel (Loaded) 3.5.0.71 - from the file "Required Folder"
Loaded at: 7965 ms - launch time impact: 39 ms
Neural Filters (Registered) 1.15.0.95 - from the file "Required Folder"
Scan time: 0 ms - entries: 31

Extensions:

Libraries 1.0.0 - from the file “C:\Program Files\Common Files\Adobe\CEP\extensions\CC_LIBRARIES_PANEL_EXTENSION_3_22_9\index.html”
PugetBench for Photoshop 0.93.6 0.93.6 - from the file “C:\Program Files (x86)\Common Files\Adobe\CEP\extensions\pugetsystems.psbenchmark\Client\index.html”
com.adobe.stock.panel.licensing-embedded 1.0.0 - from the file “C:\Program Files\Common Files\Adobe\CEP\extensions\CC_LIBRARIES_PANEL_EXTENSION_3_22_9\extensions\stock-panel-licensing\index.html”
com.adobe.capture.extension 2.0.41 - from the file “C:\Program Files\Common Files\Adobe\CEP\extensions\CC_LIBRARIES_PANEL_EXTENSION_3_22_9\extensions\capture\capture.html”
ON1 1.0.0 - from the file “C:\Program Files (x86)\Common Files\Adobe\CEP\extensions\onOne\index.html”
Export As 4.8.15 - from the file “C:\Program Files\Adobe\Adobe Photoshop (Beta)\Required\CEP\extensions\com.adobe.photoshop.crema\index.html”
Export As 4.8.15 - from the file “C:\Program Files\Adobe\Adobe Photoshop (Beta)\Required\CEP\extensions\com.adobe.photoshop.crema\index.html”
com.adobe.cclibraries.manager 1.0.0 - from the file “C:\Program Files\Common Files\Adobe\CEP\extensions\CC_LIBRARIES_PANEL_EXTENSION_3_22_9\manager.html”

Installed TWAIN devices: NONE

[Arseniy_S]

Hey @Mark.Dahm, thanks for the update!

I tried out the new Beta version and here's my results:

I am running M1 Pro Macbook with 16GB memory. I'm working with RAW image files 30-40 MB each.

After opening 40 images - all PS functions worked properly, with no performance reduction.

Opened another 40 images - slight performance decrease but still all function working properly.

Opened another 40 images (now 120 images opened) - moderate performance decrease but still everyhting working properly and no crashes or major lags.

I didn't go more than that because I wouldn't need to for my work, but I would imagine it would still work fine.

I also checked Memory Usage as I was opening images and here's what I got:

40 images opened

 

80 images opened

 

120 images opened

I have allocated PS to use 85% of my memory, so I'm pretty happy with these results. Looking forward to see this in the next PS update! 

[Mark.Dahm]

@Arseniy_S ,

Thank you so much for compiling these results! I will share them with the team, and they'll be excited to hear the data!

[Ognjen24842458mas4]

Just wanted to confirm, latest version as oftoday, ryzen 5950x, 64gigs of ram rtx 3060ti and i have the same issue 25 files limit. I will test beta now and report back.

[Ognjen24842458mas4]

Tried the beta version and it works perfectly. Over 100 files opened no issue and zero performance loss. I also noticed drag and drop with alt+tab now finnaly works properly, it auto releases the click on normal version.

[Mark.Dahm]

@Ognjen24842458mas4 ,

Thanks for the feedback! The Beta contains bug fixes that are proposed for the next full release, so often you will see some bugs fixed in there that will be rolled out with the next big release.

For those that have not tried our Beta, it installs to a different folder location than our 'regular' version, so it won't interfere with workflows (except that it could intercept the double click to open file types workflow; uninstall to stop that). You may wish to have that installed just to check every now and then if an issue you are running into has already been addressed.

[mlphoto.raw]

OMG @Mark.Dahm you guys knocked this out of the park.

I am working with the beta currently, and its snappy to each open images, and for giggles, even when I opened over 200 50mp images and doing a batch process across all of them, which makes bunch of layers and increases each open file to about 5-10GB of uncompressed tif. 

Not only does it run faster than ever, it appears stable. My pc, 12900k, 3090, 64gb is humming along happily.  

I'll use the Beta as my main squeeze over the recent official release, and report back with any issues.

Well done team. Thank you for answering our prayers finally. 🙂

One question: is there plans to allow "automate" batch processing of actions to be done "simultaneously"? vs the current sequential nature of PS to open the next image, and go through the action, and opening the next tab/image, and running the action. 

[Mark.Dahm]

@mlphoto.raw , 

Awesome; thanks for the info and I've shared with Michael P, who delivered that feature.

We often have conversations about multi-threading various features; that request is tricky, since not all features that might be included in a script could be thread safe, so it wouldn't be a quick thing to deliver.

If you have high volume workflows, one alternative could be to use our cloud APIs for those batch operations; I believe we can take local actions straight to the cloud, but naturally, there would be additional costs.

https://developer.adobe.com/photoshop/api/

[mlphoto.raw]

@Mark.Dahm I'll take what i can get. Thank you again.

This is a huge improvement in my workflow. I just gotta walk away from the pc while its doing the actions on all the open images. Better than doing it every 25 images. 

[Mohit Goyal]

Hi all,

We're happy to announce the release of Photoshop 24.5. This update includes the fix for this issue. To see the list of all fixed issues, click here

To update Photoshop to 24.5, click "Update" in the Creative Cloud desktop app next to Photoshop. More detailed instructions for updating

Let us know if the update resolves the problem for those affected, and share your feedback.

Thanks,

Mohit

[mlphoto.raw]

@Mohit Goyal & @Mark.Dahm Thank you for the new release. I've been running the beta in both m2 max & 12900k/3090 and both computers run flawlessly, and gpu works perfectly for 50+ images I usually have open for the past week or so. 

Thank you very much for the efforts. 

[chrisfromneptune]

It mostly works well for me, but when running actionscript at the end of my workflow to flatten and save the open documents (about 30-35), one of the files ended up with a handful of large white squares, so had to reinstall the old version unfortunately.

[Mark.Dahm]

Thanks @chrisfromneptune , would it be possible to share your script with us? I'm seeing a few reports of the white squares and this could help us track it down. Also, your system info output from Photoshop > Help would get us headed the right direction to solve the issue.

[Arseniy_S]

@Mark.Dahm, one thing I wanted to bring up is that it seems like the memory usage accumulates with the increased number of images open, but it doesn't go down when I close them. So for example I've worked on 30-40 images, then closed them but my memory usage remained. Opening more images continued increasing the memory usage and was reducing the performance. Is this something that can be done with a change of setting or is the only way would be to restart the app?

[Mark.Dahm]

@Arseniy_S , that's bad behavior and we're looking into that; thanks for noting here.

[Mark.Dahm]

@Arseniy_S ,

Photoshop grabs RAM when it needs it, and releases it when you quit the app, but not while you're running.

While Photoshop is running, it will dynamically de-allocate document data when files are closed, and re-use it for newly opened documents. The net effect is that it may look like Photoshop is growing its RAM allocation, but it should actually only be taking what the largest document needs, then re-using that as documents open and close.

The total size of the RAM allocated could be large because the files are exceeding the size of the already allocated RAM. That is, anyway, how it's designed to work. We ran a few quick tests here using the Beta (which is essentially the same as the last version released, plus some other new stuff), and the RAM does release when Ps closes, and does not grow beyond the amount required by the document that requires the maximum amount of RAM. Let me know if you are seeing something different; thanks for noting this.

[Ognjen24842458mas4]

Hey, just wanted to update you. I updated the regular version to the latest version, and gpu utilization is working correctly.  Strangly my alt tab issue is still not fixed( works correctly in beta, both the latest and version before, the one that had gpu utilization fix). If i make a small window and just drag and drop to photoshop it works like it should(i can move the file across the photoshop window, choosing to drop it as a new file on top bar, or a new layer in the current file), but if i have photoshop open in full screen and folder also in full screen, using alt+tab to switch the active window from folder to photoshop will trigger the release of the file by it self, effectively droping the file in photoshop where the mouse was hovering at the moment of alt tab release.  This is happening in the past few versions, but it is fixed in beta. I tried usual stuff, reinstalling, setting to default etc. I am not sure if you can follow what i am saying so i will give another example. Photoshop is running, folder with random images is also running on top of the photoshop both in full screen, i left click the image and drag it, then press alt+tab to switch to photoshop, my mouse button coordinates in pixels are lets say 700x700 pixels. As soon as i let go of alt tab, me golding the left click is ignored by photoshop and the file gets dropped at the same coordinated 700x700 pixels. I am not letting go of my left mouse button but it still happens, in the beta i can just keep moving(hovering) the file around on my svreen over photoshop until i let go of my left mouse button. I can also make a quick screen recording. Btw i am sorry because i am probably totally of the topic, but i find it hard to maneuver around the forums. Greetings