Anyone Using HP Z4 With Core i9-7940X?

[diesel5598]

Hi everyone, I am so tired of waiting for proxy files to be created that I am about to pull the trigger on a new HP Z4 with a Core i9-7940X CPU, with 64GB of memory and with my NVIDIA GTX 980ti video card in it. I am also going to use an NVME boot drive and 4 NVME cards in a storage spaces array for my working storage along with a dedicated NVME drive for cache.

All I want to do is be able to play Long GOP 4K footage in real time when working in the PP timeline without creating proxy files. Does anyone have this setup or something close to it? PugetSystems recommends the i9-7940X as the best current video editing CPU:

Core i9 Comparison

https://www.pugetsystems.com/labs/articles/Premiere-Pro-CC-2017-1-2-CPU-Performance-Core-i9-7940X-79...

I was going to build a custom workstation but the price would have been about the same minus the HP warranty and stability. I am going to do a clean install on this system with nothing but the drivers needed so all of the HP crapware will not be installed.

Before anyone recommends a custom build I want to put out there that that is not an option for me. I have built my own systems for over 20yrs and I'm done with that scene. The headaches of getting everything to work together, the tuning necessary to make it stable, and the various levels of warranty support (or lack thereof) for the various components are not worth the few dollars I might save.  I used an HP Z800 for years and it was flawless until 4K came along.

All I want to know is if anyone has the Z4 with an i9 CPU and how well it works with PP and Long GOP 4K 30/60FPS source footage.

[Jim_Simon]

All I want to do is be able to play Long GOP 4K footage in real time when working in the PP timeline without creating proxy files.

I don't believe that will be possible in the foreseeable future.  Once quantum computing becomes a reality, maybe.  But I'm skeptical that any machine currently available at a reasonable price can handle 4K H.264 with the same alacrity as Cineform proxies, especially once effects come into play.

Even Resolve, which uses the GPU for decoding and demonstrates significant performance improvement over Premiere Pro, isn't as buttery smooth with 4K H.264 as is desirable.

The better machine might well make the proxy process faster, but I think you will still see appreciably better performance with Cineform proxies than with the originals.

[Stan Jones]

I think it is always a gamble, since real world configurations vary from the test setups. But you do have a shot: look at the detailed results on the live playback. i9 7940 shows Full playback through the 4K tests, but not that it fails some of the simpler 6K.

I wonder what the effect will be of keeping you GPU.

[Averdahl]

Make sure to upgrade the graphic card if you buy a new computer. I have a HP Z440 and had a GTX 980 and noticed that 4K took very long time to process. I changed the card to a Nvidia Titan X (Pascal) and reduced export times from Premiere Pro by approx 40% - 50%.

So with a new computer you really want either a GTX 10X0 series card or the RTX cards.

[diesel5598]

I thought about upgrading the card, but when I check taskmgr in Windows 10 the GPU always seems below 10% no matter what PP is doing. I went ahead and ordered the Z4, I will report back if I still need to create proxies. Honestly, if I still do, then I'm going to send it back, since HP gives me 30 days to do so. If I need to create proxies anyway I might as well stick with my current setup.

I use the GH5 for most of my video and it does have an All-I option, but it uses so much more storage over Long GOP that so far I have stuck with Long GOP. I did just order some 128GB SD cards that were on sale for Black Friday, so I'm going to do some All-I tests with 4K 60FPS media on the Z4, if anything involving the Z4 will get me to 50% playback resolution at 100%FPS with no dropped frames then that will be my setup going forward and compression strategy going forward.

It is just so annoying and time consuming waiting for proxy files. Also, with my workflow I like to only import clips into PP that I will use in the timeline, so I organize everything in Windows Explorer, synch the audio, then start importing clips as I need them, this means that midway through the timeline I'm always waiting on some proxy job to complete; frustrating to say the least. I may need to change my workflow.

[R Neil Haugen]

You can set the proxies to be made overnight or while you are away from the computer for something else. It's less interference with your work and less annoying also.

And check with Puget Systems, Safe Harbor Computers, and ADK. They are companies specializing in video post computers and all three have staffers who regularly pop in here to advise people on hardware and especially on the Hardware forum.

They can give you quotes once they've asked you quite a few questions about your needs. And their sites have information on computer parts in post work.

Neil

[diesel5598]

Thanks Neil, I did a lot of research on the Puget Systems site prior to ordering the Z4 and their test results are how I picked the CPU. I think the Z4 is so new the only way to see if it will work for me and my workflow is to try it firsthand. Hopefully I do not have to send it back.

My workflow probably needs work, but right now I import everything into Windows Explorer from the source media, pick the "keeper" clips, number them in the order I will use them on the timeline then start importing them into PP. By this point I mentally know the whole flow of the video and want to start working on the project right away; not wait for proxy files. And contrary to Adobe's statement "you can continue working while the proxy files are created in the background" this never works for me. PP is unusable while it is creating proxy files.

[diesel5598]

I just thought I would relay my findings so far. The Z4 arrived with 16GB of memory, the 14 core I9 and a single OS NVME drive, I added a video card I had laying around (NVS 510) and I loaded Win10, PP, and Davinci Resolve. I added some 4K 100MBs 30FPS and 60 FPS Panasonic GH5 Long GOP footage and P4P 4K 60FPS P4P footage to the timeline. I also configured PP to render previews using CPU only since the video card is trash.

PP was able to play the footage at 1/8 and 1/4 resolution without dropping a frame. I then added some cross fade transitions and it still worked flawlessly. I color graded one of the clips and still no problems. I then added an adjustment layer and a color grade to the adjustment layer; no problems. Scrubbing through the timeline is pretty jumpy, and at 1/1 playback resolution there was some stutter, but that's it. Exports speeds were nearly 1:1. I did not try adding 4K footage to a 1080P timeline.

My conclusion so far is that this setup is borderline acceptable. Definitely a big step up from my previous configuration but I don't think it can handle a multi-cam sequence or nested clips, or a completed project with full color grading and still maintain playback even at 1/8.

BTW Davinci Resolve could not play any of the media without crashing. I'm sure its due to the trash video card that I was testing with. My next step is to finish up my open projects on my current system, then migrate the archived and pending projects to the new system. I'll also move over my real video card (GTX 980ti) my quad NVME RAID card, add 48GB of memory, and add a dedicated SSD drive for PP cache files. When all of that is done, and PP is properly tuned, I think I'll finally be able to work with 4K Long GOP footage in realtime. This should serve me well for the next 5yrs until 8K comes along.

[R Neil Haugen]

My only comment at this point is I'd suggest looking at a 1000-series GPU. The 980s were good cards, but the next gen is rather better and will hold up better over time. Oh ... does the 980 have 4GB of vRAM?

Edit: Just looked up the card ... with over 2,000 CUDA cores and 6GB of vRAM, that's a pretty decent card all right ... it's the changes in "architecture" of the 1000-series that over time will show more.

Neil

[diesel5598]

Yes I don't doubt that my videocard will suffice for my needs, I have had it for around 4yrs so far and I've never seen the GPU go over 20% except during performance tests, I did a lot of research before picking that specific card and in my opinion it still has the best price to performance ratio. If it ever shows up as the bottleneck I will replace it.

I just did a complete project on my new setup and it worked great. I had mixed 4K footage from the GH5 and 4K footage from the P4P and was able to complete the project with transitions, color grades, etc. without proxies. None of it was 60FPS though so not sure yet if it will hold up to that. Also, on export the export speeds were actually faster than 1:1 maybe even as high as 120% which was great. The sequence was set to 1080P and I enabled CUDA hardware acceleration since I had installed the 980ti.  Below is my complete hardware setup in case anyone decides to replicate my setup. The only thing I have left to do is upgrade the memory to 64GB of memory (HP wanted almost 2x the price for their memory):

Processor / Platform

HP Z4 with Core i9-7940X (singe socket 14 cores)

Video Card

NVIDIA GTX 980ti

Memory

16GB of DDR-2666 memory

Storage Layout

256GB NVME drive (OS)

4 x NVME drives combined into a single 2TB Storage Spaces RAID5 volume (Current Projects)

Dell Ultraspeed drive Quad (4 port NVME PCIe x16 card)

2 x 10TB Seagate Ironwolf drives combined into a single 10TB Storage Spaces RAID1 Volume (90 day Archive/Library/Stock Footage)

1 x 1TB Sandisk SSD (Cache drive)

1 x Lexar Workflow Professional H1 (Media Reader)

To get the Dell Ultraspeed card to work you will need to enable PCIe bifurcation in the BIOS. The Dell Ultraspeed card is way cheaper than the HP equivalent, does the same thing, and worked just fine in the HP. The Ironwolf drives are great, they completely spin down when not in use; saving power and heat.

I know plenty of people like to build their own systems, but I have a 4yr warranty, and same day business service, not to mention everything just works; I'll take that any day over a custom build.

[R Neil Haugen]

That system is running fine, thanks for posting the detailed info!

Neil