Graph Editor is garbage

[Steve5D7C]

I'm mostly a Maya animator, and although I've been using AE for 20+ years it's mostly been as a compositing tool and never really had to do too much fine editing of animation. I'm now doing a full 2D/2.5D animation project in AE, and I cannot BELIEVE how absolutely rubbish the graph editor and motion editing tools are. I know this is a well-known fact about AE, but I'm still flabbergasted at just how pathetic the graph editor is and how even the most basic animation curve editing features are rudimentary beyond belief and totally lacking in user friendliness. I am mostly trying to work with Puppet Tool animation. First issue there is NO ABILITY TO SEPARATE CHANNELS on position pins, a capability that exists on just about everything else. Why is this missing? This then has the knockon effect of not being able to frame only one X or Y curve easily, since the button to do this automatically frames both channels. I have yet to figure out if there is an easy way to zoom in and out of curves in the same way there is in Maya's graph editor. It's worth noting that AE's 3D camera navigation shortcuts pretty much are the same as Maya's, so why on earth is it not also possible to implement something similar in the 2D view of the graph editor. This is 2021, and editing animation curves is essential in any animation tool, so why are AE's capabilities stuck in the late 90s? Why is there still not a separate expandable window for the graph editor, like there is for just about everything else? I also hate the way that framing keyframes in the graph editor ALSO frames keyframes in the timeline, which I usually do not want, so constantly have to readjust my framing when I switch back to the layer view. Overall, editing animation in AE is just a nightmare and incredibly time consuming in a way it simply should not be.

[Mylenium]

They got it wrong when it was new and everyone's complaints fell on deaf ears, so I wouldn't expect any fundamental changes any time soon.

Mylenium

[mikolajkamler]

Steve,

I had the same experience when I started working in AE, but it turned out I was wrong.

Before you start complaining, just right-click any Position property - you should have a "Separate dimensions" option here. Click it - and you're done. This way animation won't be a nightmare to you anymore. 🙂

And remember - before you get angry with your software, take some time to actually read the documentation.

Also - this may help you ( a tutorial from School of Motion, really helpful ).

Have a good day,

Mikołaj

[Steve5D7C]

I think I clearly stated in the OP that puppet pins have no capability to separate dimensions. Remember -- before you reply with helpful suggestions, take some to actually read the original post.

[Steve5D7C]

That tutorial was great -- if you're a complete animation novice. I've been doing it for 20 years, and it did nothing to address any of the issues I have (and clearly explained) with the useless graph editor. Think before you post a "helpful" answer. Or maybe you work for Adobe's Correct the Record dept?

[mikolajkamler]

Please, calm down.

Sorry for offending you. For some reason - it must have been late at night 🙂 -  I have misread your post and thought that you had problems with separating dimensions in general, and not specifically in the puppet tool (which is a lousy tool, I agree). That'll teach me to not offer help without carefully checking if it's really needed. I might again run into an easily offended specialist 🙂

And no, I do not work for Adobe, nor am I affiliated with School of Motion. I wish I would, for my salary might be better then 🙂

Cheers,

Mikołaj

[mikolajkamler]

OK, so the following solution is just a work-around and does not solve the issue of the Puppet Tool being garbage, but...

Try making some nulls and parenting the pins' position (and scale and rotation if you're using advanced pins) to them. I agree this is a bit of work, especially if you have a lot of pins - but this way you get the possibility to separate the properties. 

Also, this eliminates what is the most annoying thing about puppet pins IMHO, that you have to open 4 levels down the layer in the timeline until you get to them 🙂 This way, you can hide/shy the whole layer if you want and leave only the controller nulls...

Hope this helps you some.

Still not working for Adobe,

Mikołaj

[mikolajkamler]

Also, if you're coming from a 3D editing tool, something much better for 2D/2.5D animation - especially for rigging, but also for many other animation uses is the DuIK Bassel plug-in. It enables you, among other things, to built a well-functioning IK rig, which can also incorporate things deformed with the Puppet tool. It works really well. Plus, it's completely free, one more reason to check it out...

Mikołaj

[AHearsum · Accepted solution]

Two and half years late to the party but came across this post of yours during a search for disattisfied users of the Maya Graph Editor. Your complaint is clearly on a different level but I cant help but point out the infuriating deficiency in Maya's editor (from my perspective). I'm going to trump your 20years of experience with my 33years and simply post this video I made of the way in which competing software handles key tangent scaling. It drives me nuts having been used to Softimage and then laterly Houdini's curve editor. 

[steve_1348]

Well, sorry to trump you back but your video is nonsense. You're breaking the tangents in Maya, it's rarely necessary or desirable to do that, and to get the behavior in Maya's graph ed that you have demonstrated in other programs, you simply need to enable weighted tangents on your curves. Seriously, do you think Maya would reign as character animation king if it behaved that way?

[AHearsum]

Agreed, breaking tangents is rarely a good thing to do, I was simply demonstrating the  way to get asymmetrical scaling of the handles in Maya which is to break the continuity of the in and out tangents of the key. It's simply not possible to get  asymmetrical scaling of the handles while maintaining the continuity. That is the main problem. Believe me I've had this conversation many many times over the years with Maya users who fail to grasp what I mean. I challenge you to reproduce the easy with which it is done in the other software shown in my video. As for why you would want it?.............It allows you to use fewer keys and it allows for easier subtle fine tuning of the curves. I acknowledge that Maya is king of animation and I have used it exclusively over the past few years and there are many good things about it but this aspect of the fcurve functionality is substandard as is evidenced by how many other software has it as standard. 

[steve_1348]

I misunderstood what you were showing, and now I see what you're demonstrating -- in Maya both sides of the bezier handle will scale, in other software you can pull one side out and not the other, while maintaining tangency. Personally, I've never found this to be a huge drawback though.

[AHearsum]

Thanks Steve, it usually takes a bit longer to make myself understood. I was getting ready to get out my wallet to make a wager🙂. I guess if you've never had that facility then you can't imagine the delight in using it. I was absolutely in shock when I first started using Maya but, of course, you find ways of working around it. You might be interested to know that sidefx used to consult with us on their trips to London on how to improve their appeal to animators and I like to think we played a small part in them adopting this fcurve functionality a few years back. Up until  then their curve editor was similarly limited. Going back to the original complaint about after effects you should try Davinci Resolve's curve editor!! You would pull ALL your hair out not just some of it. It takes the prize for worst curve editor ever.