P: Completely broken Hand tool (PS24.5) Hand Tool Sticking, sticky, not seeing mouse-up

[Jqqerry]

This is a bug. Please don't move it to the Discussions tab.

And please don't merge into another unrelated thread. I will report a bug with this thread.

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I made a YouTube video using a keyboard mouse overlay to show what action I'm taking. I hope you can refer to refer to it.

https://youtu.be/Cle6dEgP5_Y

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I was disappointed that there were so many bugs that were not fixed in 24.5, but I was still trying to give it a shot.

However, this bug is pretty serious. Really...

Please see the video I attached.
If you watch the video, you will see that I am shaking the screen.
I'm not using a hand tool, it should release automatically, but that thing is sticky.

To release this sticky, pinned handtool, you'll need to make one more unconditional click.

Here's how I've organized them for your reference.

< What I can be sure of >

1. Window10 (Tested a total of 14 PCs)
2. Use WacomTablet
3. Not related to preferences at all (Especially not related to Spring loaded, Flick panning stuff things)
4. I've tried all the known Photoshop troubleshooting methods and no improvement.
5. Even reinstalling Windows does the same thing
6. Only in 24.5 does this bug occur with certainty. I can't reproduce it at all in earlier versions.

< I'm not sure about the >

1. Mac OS not tested
2. I couldn't even test if it was a GPU company difference. I and my team all use NVIDIA

And while there are a few threads pointing this out, there doesn't seem to be a proper plan to fix it.

If this is not fixed in 24.6, 24.6 will be equally unusable as 24.5.

Also check out the links below.

https://community.adobe.com/t5/photoshop-ecosystem-discussions/hand-tool-lock-after-releasing-spaceb...

https://community.adobe.com/t5/photoshop-ecosystem-bugs/some-ps-tools-keep-reading-wacom-pen-after-l...

https://community.adobe.com/t5/photoshop-ecosystem-discussions/hand-tool-won-t-let-go-of-image/m-p/1...

https://community.adobe.com/t5/photoshop-ecosystem-bugs/24-5-impossible-to-use-with-wacom-intuos-on-...

(cjbutler 1/12/24: edited title from "not reverting to cursor" to "not seeing mouse up" to reflect latest focus on lost mouse-up as root cause, and not just a stale cursor setting.)

[CJButler]

And, this is a bit of a long shot, but again presuming Windows: Do you have "ClickLock" enabled? It is a Windows Accessibility thing for Mice. If enabled, it has some settings for when ClickLock engages.

[A.L.5E2E]

Clicklock is disabled 😞 I wish it were that simple haha

[7x8]

> Has everyone fixed this bug? I'm just watching the thread because I can't test it because it's the busiest season. Also, since it is not included in fixed issue page (although it is natural because some changes are applied), I am curious about your opinion.

@Jqqerry  you can have two versions installed at the same time I guess, at least that's what I did and checked every 25 update, using 24.0 for work. In my case with 25.6 - no sticky hand when panning with space.

[NikVladi]

I haven't worked in Photoshop for a long time, today there was something I needed to do... the latest version... I saw this problem... I thought it was an issue with my PC... it was the same on my laptop... I was very angry... it is absolutely impossible to work in Photoshop, it’s just absolutely... then I found this topic... June 2023??? Seriously, do zoo instances work in Adobe? (abuse removed) Just tell me how this shame even got into release and stayed there for almost a year???

[CJButler]

> I haven't worked in Photoshop for a long time, today there was something I needed to do... the latest version... 

Hi Nik, can I get some more information from you?

1. Can you confirm the actual version number where you observed the problem? And the platform (presumed to be Windows)? 
   
2. Are you using a Mouse only, or are you using a Pen/Stylus? Per the last Sticky Note for this thread, there have been changes in 25.6 for Mouse users, and there are changes in 25.7 for Pen/Stylus users.
3. Can you describe exactly the gesture that is failing for you? Is it the lost mouse-up when using the Hand Tool as described in the original thread, or is it something else? If something else, can you describe the steps in greater detail as precisely as you can: What Tool are you using? Are you using a keyboard chording method (e.g. Space Key in Move Tool to get to the Hand Tool)? What are you clicking on (some control point?) How are you moving your Mouse (or Pen)? When are you releasing the Mouse Button (or lifting the Pen), and then what happens? Please give as precise steps as possible so we can try to reproduce.

I crafted an Event Logging Tool that can help us look at things in greater detail. If you can reproduce stuck mouse-up on 25.6 or later, we would like to examine a log file from that event when it happens.

If you are curious as to why this bug took so long, there are a number of earlier posts that have more information. The major blocker for us was our inability to reproduce the bug at Adobe.

[Jqqerry]

@CJButler I installed 25.6 and tried it and neither the mouse nor the wacompen finally managed to recreate this bug (I did it for about 20 minutes). So this feels fixed.
Good!

But I felt a little heterogeneous in the movement of the screen.
So while I was holding down on the Spacebar, I tried moving it around with my mouse or pen, and I shook the screen. And it seems to be quite disconnected (if the original screen was 60 frames, now it's not as smooth as 24 frames) It's a metaphor.

Is it because of the process of reporting mouse ups and downs? Definitely feels a lot of difference compared to 24.0.1 or Photoshop 21.0.3 before that.
Of course, I don't shake the screen that much while working on it, but I think it's a lag or an issue that can be felt enough because I often move the screen.
So I roll back again.... =(

[CJButler]

@Jqqerry I don't think that drawing problem has anything to do with the original problem as reported in this thread (stuck mouse-up).

This is out of my areas of expertise, but it sounds possibly like a drawing framerate issue. It may be related to the character of the document content or the GPU settings. Or both. I recommend you start a new thread on this issue, especially if it is blocking your use of the latest version of the product. Of course, you'll need to be clear as to why it is impacting your workflows. A new bug will need to be logged; it will be probably assigned to the Photoshop GPU team for investigation.

In general, when using the Hand Tool, I would expect screen caches to be in effect, and for most modern machines, this should be very fast and seamless. If the caches are being invalidated for some reason, that could the cause a redraw to occur, and could be the reason for the laggy drawing experience. Adobe QE will want a sample document and precise steps to reproduce.

(Maybe some other Adobe person watching this thread has some ideas for you.)

[Jqqerry]

@CJButler Thank you for your kind and prompt response.

Yes, that's correct. Since this doesn't seem to relate to the topic of the thread I reported on, "Hand tool," I won't add any further content to this thread.

I'll be taking a break in a month, during which I plan to record screens on multiple PCs and compare various versions to create a new thread. Based on today's tests, it doesn't seem to be a specs issue with PCs, as I noticed this on PCs with Intel 14th generation CPUs, Ryzen 7000 series CPUs, and GPUs from the 4000 series. It sounds like a good plan to double-check on your old laptop when you get home after work today.

[Benjamin32760768enyn]

It is unacceptable that this is Still a bug with no solution. There are forum posts going back years to 2021 about this issue. I’m restarting photoshop every 5 minutes because of this.

While panning and zooming, using a Wacom Intuos, or a mouse and keyboard, the mouse arrow is white regardless of the tool selected and the all actions are unresponsive. Menu items and tool bars are active and selectable but nothing on the canvas is functional.

This is a core interface functionality issue that irreparably breaks the program.

What are we paying for here?

[Chad Rolfs]

@Benjamin32760768enyn Just to be clear, the issue you're referring to is that the cursor gets stuck as a pointer but still functions normally and DOES NOT get stuck functionally, i.e. where you click+drag and when you release the mouse button or lift stylus off the canvas it remains connected/stuck to what you were dragging (transform, making selection, panning). 

Please clarify which issue you are experiencing.  They are 2 different issues.  This thread is related to the latter issue with functionality, not the cursor icon. 

[CJButler]

@Benjamin32760768enyn I'll just add to what Chad said. I have no idea from your description how to even try to reproduce the problem you are experiencing. Can we get some basic infomration?

1. OS Platform (Win, Mac)? Photoshop Version (e.g. 25.6)?
2. A more precise series of steps that exhibits the problem (e.g. New default document, etc.). The fewer steps the better.
3. Do you have any third-party plugins installed?
4. When Photoshop becomes unresponsive can you recall what you were doing just before that point in time? In as precise detail as you can.

When we have this information, we'll try to reproduce on our side.

[NikVladi]

Perhaps I will now say something very strange to you, but there is such a thing as logging. For example, the user clicks on the button to start recording a log and does some actions, after which he clicks on the button to finish recording the log, after which the user can take a log file in a certain folder and send it here. The log may contain data from both Photoshop and the operating system. Or can logging happen automatically? Why ask the same question every time about the user’s actions and computer data? Ask the user to go into Photoshop, click on a button, do the actions, click on the button, and then send you the log.  

[abuse removed by moderator]

[CJButler]

@NikVladi In my earlier reply to you, I asked you several questions and I provided information on how to invoke the Event Logging mechanism. You did not reply. Did you miss that?

Event logging has performance overhead, which is why it is not enabled by default. There is also the Photoshop Help > System Info... report, but it does not have information which is helpful for understanding Event Issues. Most of the information in that report are focused on plugins and GPU information, which have been historic problem areas. It does confirm things like platform, OS version, Photoshop version, and basic system configuration, which can be helpful at times.

Ultimately, though, we have to reproduce the issue before we can make meaningful progress.

Photoshop version 25.7 has been released. Can you confirm this is the version you are using?

[Chad Rolfs]

@NikVladi Yes 

[NikVladi]

@Chad Rolfs 

I don't see it. What version do you have?

[NikVladi]

@CJButler 

Sorry. I saw your message, but didn't respond. I just read the whole thread and decided it was useless. I installed 24.4.1. I will not install new versions until I see that the problem is fixed.

[CJButler]

@NikVladi Please try version 25.7. You can leave older versions installed. (I have 8 versions on my machine).

[NikVladi]

@CJButler 

Hallelujah! Everything is fine in version 25.7.0... Thanks!

[CJButler]

@NikVladi You're welcome.

[Just-Justin]

I implore you please fix the old problem(s) before you release new features.
I posted this A problem in photoshop lastest version(v25.6) asked to fix but you didn't.

Even you brought the problem to v25.7. OMG! Do you really think new features are what your customers need most?
Click the link to see what this bug is about ！

[Kuttyjoe]

Version 25.7 is still buggy.  Tools still sticking within 3 seconds of opening a new document.    25.5.1 is the last version for me where the tools do not stick, but it crashes at least once a day.

[CJButler]

@Kuttyjoe Can you give us a more detailed description and more precise steps on exactly what you are doing in 25.7 that exhibits "Tools still sticking within 3 seconds of opening a new document". Step-by-step, what OS platform, exactly which tools you are using, exactly where do you click , and what does "sticking" mean? Is this the lost mouse-up problem? or something else? We'd like to try and reproduce. Thanks.

[Kuttyjoe]

Open new document.  Immediately try to zoom in and out with Control/Spacebar, or Pan with spacebar and see if it sticks.  It sticks immediately within 3 seconds.  It's not a new problem. It's the same problem.  By "sticking", I mean that when I release the mouse, the zoom tool or the pan tool is still active. They're sticking.  If I'm moving the mouse around then it's still zooming or panning while holding no buttons on mouse or keyboard.

I'm on a Windows 10 PC.

[CJButler]

@Kuttyjoe Please confirm the following:

• Windows (version?) Thanks I see you added that.
• No Pen attached?
• New default document?
• After you open the document, are you in the Move Tool by default? If not, which Tool?
• What happen when you don't use a keyboard chording gesture? i.e specifically choose the Hand Tool or Zoom Tool and no space bar or control key on another Tool. (I'm not suggesting this is a fix, it's just data. It is important that keyboard chording works.)
• Are you using the keyboard chording at the same instant that your mouse down? i.e. Is it key down and mouse-down at very close to the same instant, or is key down first, see the cursor change, then mouse-down?

It sounds like a lost-mouse-up situation similar to what we've been hunting all this time. After clariifying steps, we'll try to reproduce. If that fails, we'll probably ask you to generate an Event Log file. Thanks.

[Kuttyjoe]

I have a stylus. And my monitor is a Cintiq but I wasn't using the stylus.  Performance is typically worse with the stylus even before this problem happened.

Not a default document.  I just opened a png file which I'd just created from Illustrator.

The default tool is the move tool.

"

• What happen when you don't use a keyboard chording gesture? i.e specifically choose the Hand Tool or Zoom Tool and no space bar or control key on another Tool. (I'm not suggesting this is a fix, it's just data. It is important that keyboard chording works.)"

Are you saying, if I were to select the hand tool, use it, then switch to another tool, then see if it's still on the hand tool?  I don't know.  I instantly uninstalled Photoshop as soon as I saw that it was still not fixed because I'm really pissed about the time I waste doing this and the other issues that it causes.  Installing and uninstalling causes issues with which program is default for opening documents.  It causes issues with default programs in Bridge. It also sometimes causes an issue with Astute Graphics over in Illustrator which gets confused about Photoshop because, one function of that plugin is that it opens an image in Photoshop to be edited.  It starts throwing up an error message and it's hard to fix. So I'm extremely reluctant to even install any new version of Photoshop and have to deal with all of that, just to find in 3 seconds that it's not fixed, then uninstall it and wrestle with all those issues.