BUG: Use Previews....Doesn't Use Previews.

[scrozier]

This workflow has been broken for a long time and I would really love to fix this one. I know this used to be on uservoice but I can't find the old bug. 

Steps:

1. Set sequence preview file to "Apple ProRes 422HQ" or whatever your favorite is. 

2. Render Sequence to full green.

3. Go to Export, Select an H.264 preset, check "use previews"

4. Watch as PrPro doesn't acess a single preview on disk and instead renders the whole timeline from scratch. 

From my current example I have a .png sequence from blender than I've rendered to green in the timeline.

Export->H.264, use previews checked...

Look at windows resource monitor, why is premiere chewing up PNGs when it should just be referencing the preview files I JUST RENDERED. 

.aecache files being acessed for no reason. 

.png sequence being read. WHY. 

[scrozier]

Anyone from Adobe dev team care to respond? @Francis-Crossman @Fergus H . This is a big gap in functionality. 

[michaelp92032205]

Today I just went back and opened an old project in Premiere 2022. It was rendered in the timeline using ProRes and exported to H.264 and I clicked "use previews" and it used the previews during the export the way it's supposed to.

Sure would be great if the 2024 version of the program worked like that. How can you break a feature and call it an upgrade?

[scrozier]

I don't trust media encoder (many, many failures over the years, been burned too many times to use it with any sort of confidence) but I may have to lean into it more as its nearly a 5x speedup because it actually respects the use previews switch most of the time!

14 min timeline.... Exported in 1min 49 seconds. 

Output from Rendered(all green) ProRes422LT Timeline to H.264 ~1:49 through media encoder with "use native" unchecked. 

Output from Premiere, same exact settings. Esentially hit "export" instead of "queue" in the export dialog. 

... 6:45. 

This is a less severe example since its just 1 layer of color and 3.2k ProResLT media and minimal dynamic links. On other jobs this could be up to a 10x speed bump but the lack of engineering response by Adobe seems like they think this performance being left on the table is a non-issue. 

These kinds of inconsistencies from app to app and year to year are what drives people like me crazy. Our job is both technical and creative and problem solving is part of the job, but you just want your established workflows to WORK not bug out every other release. Make use previews...use previews every time....

I don't want to have to render out to an intermediate ProRes file anymore, its too many hoops when you're on a tight deadline and adds more QC issues. 

[R Neil Haugen]

Good information there, thanks for posting!

[JonesVid]

Yes, I fully agree with the comment on QC software issues. You work with one Premiere Pro release get to know the pitfalls, but you can work around stuff.

Then the new release comes out .... (deep breath everyone) and the whole situation is turned upside down on its head where core things that worked don't anymore.

From my experience this points to :

1. Code is poorly structured and like a patchwork quilt

2. Design is poorly documented

3. Trying to spread software maintenance across too many teams with weak management

4. Weak QC/QA procedures and bypassing core functionality

5. Fee paying subscribers are the QA department

When you post an issue in Bug Reports  that can be replicated - there is never any Adobe Engineering response.

They tend to like attending to easy stuff like "the colour of my button is not orange but red" ......etc

I'm just getting a bit fed up with this.

[MobyTrix]

Interestingly, the export-with-previews is only supposed to work from within premiere pro itself, and that's how I used to use it because media encoder in the past did not honor that option.  In fact, their own documentation states the same thing.

Maybe they're migrating the functionality to Media Encoder; I'll have to check.  I wouldn't be surprised, since the new in-Premiere export dialog is hot garbage.

[Richard23394131sqn1]

I just tried it using Media Encoder and it did not work. Does work from export media though. Use previews is under general at the bottom of the settings window. At least it works that way.

[JonesVid]

Which codec are you using for your renders?

Even if I have all complete ProRes422 renders present in the video previews folder Premiere does not access any of them and re-renders the entire timeline. 
At least that was how it behaved the last time I tried it.

Which version of Premiere are you using ?

[SpaceCherryFilms]

Ok I'm loving this thread.  The "Use Previews" used to work as it was designed to do. Use previews in the render to speed it up.  I remember using this feature to tske my timeline (which was DNXHR I think back then) to h264 and it was super fast export.  Then one version it just broke and wouldn't use the previews anymore. Not I'm doing what everyone else is, render the preview in Prores then exporting that out then doing the extra step of taking the prores file and rendering it to h264.  In the past I didn't have to do that.   And I have been using Premiere since version CS4, and WITHOUT fail Adobe will give us something new in a update but then take away something we need.  It's the Adobe way. 

[Ryan Fritzsche]

I'm having a hard time undersanding why this is such a difficult thing to fix.  I don't need the software to try to nanny what codec my previews are in, and I don't need a discussion about whether I should generate my master from long-gop interstitial files (who uses long-gop for previews anyway??).  I just want a button that says "use previews", thatn when checked, means PP and AME will use them, however crappy they do or don't look, no matter what resolution they are, etc.  The reality of most edit projects these days is that there are countless lo-res, lo-quality exports for review and notes, and then only one or two masters at the very end.  So speed is more important than quality on the vast majority of the exports I do.  I want the quality, of course, when I need it for a master.  But this is not a peripheral issue: it is a core issue to my workflow.

[JonesVid]

I would fully agree that it is difficult to comprehend why this annoying bug of not using previews on export has not been fixed.

The arrogance of Premiere Pro engineering to not even engage on this 'bug report' is also adding to the frustration of subscribing to software that does not function correctly.

[R Neil Haugen]

This is a primarily user to user forum, and they've relied on users helping others for most posts here. Staffer activity over the last year though is up rather dramatically. And they have recognized this is an issue.

They haven't popped back in with a final fix, no. Which would be a great thing, and yea, that this has taken so freaking long is frustrating.

[scrozier]

Bump. Still looking for someone from Adobe dev team to actually respond to this. New coat of paint is all well and good but this type of functionality is whats actually important. 

[JonesVid]

I have had some feedback from Adobe Support on this very recently.

If you use 'Match Sequence Settings' for the Export it will automatically 'tick use previews' and actually does use them on export.

It no longer renders the whole timeline again.

If you actually select the AppleProRes422  codec manually and same criteria as your previews it will not work.? Why... no idea.

I have always been selecting Apple ProRes 422 4K 50fps to match my preview settings - but for some weird reason it will not work if you do that.

I have tested it twice and have produced an Apple ProRes 422 master a lot quicker now. Before it re-rendered the whole timeline every time and by passed rendered previews.

Try using 'Match Sequence Settings' and see if it works for you

Incidentally, I am also in contact with Adobe Support about the 'Lost Previews' issue. This is where you have rendered everything (as far as you have edited) and close the project. Randomly it loses some previews when you open the project again - not always - its a random thing on my machine. It does it on my Windows 11 and Windows 10 platforms

Engineering are still working on it - but Adobe Support have seen it happen with their own eyes on my machine with Remote Desktop session.

https://community.adobe.com/t5/premiere-pro-bugs/some-prores-422-video-preview-files-lost-on-closing...

[scrozier]

Thanks JonesVid, but as we've outlined in this lengthy thread, we are talking about the loss of doing any sort of H.264 or other output from already rendered timeline preview files. I.E. "Using Previews" no matter the final output.  Getting a "smart render" out has still worked most of the time, but any sort of re-encode from previewed files has been broken for what feels like 5 years at least. 

[Shebbe]

Yea I too realized last week that picking Match Sequence actually works but manually selecting identical codec format doesn't. Yet another area where the whole Use Preview mechanism is simply broken. And for reasons the entire thread even exists; encoding to H264 from a ProRes 422/4444 rendered timeline is one of the biggest desires in speeding up workflows which now still would require another conversion step after the ProRes render if going with the workaround. Nobody should ever set h264 as the timeline preview format, it would defeat al means of QC after rendering the timeline.

[JonesVid]

Yes,  agree with you both Shebbe & Scrozier on the point about H264 output when you have a say, a fully rendered ProRes timeline available.

I must admit I have been banging my head against the wall for nearly two years just trying to get the Smart Rendered output working when Use Previews was ticked, so that has been my focus.

Now I can get the master I can re-encode to H264 etc, but yes, its more time wasting and shouldn't be necessary really.

I think there is a need for some serious code re-work in the Export area now for Premiere Pro.

[JonesVid]

Sorry I meant to add here : from a logical point of view - the fact that Smart rendering does not work when you choose the Codec yourself ( and have to use Match Sequence Settings) suggests to me the piece of code that looks to see what Codec you have chosen to output to - now doesn't exist. It only looks for Match Sequence Settings.

That's my theory !

[Shebbe]

That may well be true. But it doesn't change the fact that a checkbox exists that is named "Use Previews" that doesn't use preview files when encoding to any format. If Adobe doesn't deem this a bug they should remove the checkbox because it doesn't do anything. And the preset Match Sequence Settings may as well have an internal Use Previews mechanic.

But I'm pretty sure that hasn't been the intent. And multiple users including me claim this function actually used to work but years have past since and it's still broken...

[Kevin-Monahan]

The status of this bug report has been updated.

[scrozier]

@Kevin-Monahan What more info do you need? I feel like we've provided a lot here. I'm happy to walk through whats going on if it moves the needle, but a little alarmed that someone can look at this thread and come up with "needs more info."

[Kevin-Monahan]

Hello @scrozier,

Thanks for the question, and sorry for the confusion. Changing the status of a bug report to "Needs More Info" signals the editor and the product team to collaborate more to ensure enough information is in place to reproduce and fix a bug.

The community has provided a lot of information here. Thank you! Since this bug has a history and many upvotes, it would be great if a product team member could comment on what else is needed. I will submit the issue again with them on internal channels to see if we can get more traction here.

This is a reminder that I'm not a Premiere Pro product team member, but I'm doing my best to solve this issue for the community. Sorry for the frustration.

Thanks,
Kevin

[scrozier]

@Kevin-Monahan thanks for clarifying and for continuing to advocate for this internally!